UK & World News
Beer Tax Debate Heads To Parliament

Campaigners calling for an end to a policy which pushes beer prices up faster than the rate of inflation have won the right to a debate in Parliament.
The beer duty escalator was introduced by the last government in 2008. It means the cost of a pint rises by an additional 2% every year.
Stephen Pugh is the financial director of the brewer Adnams in Southwold, Suffolk. He believes the policy is misguided.
"The duty will be 50p or so on the pint and the VAT will be a similar amount, so you are talking about adding £1 of tax for the government on that.
"I think that's an expensive and damaging level of costs to the consumer."
Many pubs have been unable to survive in the recent economic climate. Six thousand have closed in the past four years.
It is causing so much concern that more than 100,000 people have signed an online petition urging the government to scrap the escalator. The petition has been organised by the beer campaign group CAMRA.
The issue will now be debated in Parliament on Thursday.
David Sanchez runs the Lord Nelson pub in the Suffolk seaside town.
To get a realistic profit after paying all the tax he says he should sell his bitter for £4 a pint. But he believes that price is too high and so it sells for £3.40.
"You can't really price the beer where it needs to be to maintain the current profitability so we have to keep the beer prices down to encourage customers to keep coming in.
"They still whinge at the price... It's all part of the banter these days."
Beer duty has increased by 42% since the escalator was introduced in 2008 while sales have fallen by 15% in that period.
And the rate of decline is rising. Between July and September there was a 5.6% fall in the volume of beer sold in pubs and shops compared to the same quarter last year, although it is thought the bad weather this summer may have had an impact on sales.
A spokesman for the Treasury said a range of tax measures had been introduced to help the alcohol industry, and pubs in particular.
"However at a time when we are working hard to get down the deficit, alcohol duty revenues do make an important contribution to the public finances.
"Crucially, the Government has not made any changes beyond what was announced at the budget in 2008."
But in the past three months 117 million fewer pints have been sold.
And, according to the industry, that means that tax revenue from beer is actually being hit because people cannot afford to buy it.
The British Beer and Pub Association wants duty to be frozen in the next budget.
Research carried out for the organisation suggests it would save 5000 jobs in the industry.
But the fear is, if prices keep being driven higher, more pubs will be forced to call time for good.
what do you think?

Bob Attoe
what about a wine and spirit tax and a cigar tax

stewgwyn
Hang on a minute Bob, I'm not rich but I like wine !

Bob Attoe
dont worry im not gunna tax it

Bazil Brush
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Michael Hawkins
I am fine with that I enjoy a good chicken Tika Masala which would of course be tax free

shaun spencer
Theyd be better off targeting the cheap white cider that the teenagers manage to buy.

Windows Live User
I would like know what the treasury Spokesman means when he says "a range of tax measures had been introduced to help the alcohol industry, and pubs"? Camra have been excellent at playing their part Pubs/clubs in my small town have/are closing hand over fist leaving only a couple open. The social meeting places of the town are fast going as is night life. Although not social centres in themselves, even the library and large police station and council offices have all closed. With the closing down of the high street shops there is now no reason to go there at all. It is fast becoming a ghost town and I expect to see tumbleweed blowing through shortly

shaun spencer
Everythimg here has closed.the police station the libary and many many pubs.these have become resturants.i live in an area that relies solely on the tourest industry.local youngsters cant afford property because of the many second homes here.in the winter the town literally becomes a ghost town.largely because of out ot town supermarkets.its very sad to see your home town dying.

shaun spencer
If any of you have been to clovelly north devon which many tourists visit yourll know the area in which i speak

Michael Hawkins
The breweries also have a lot to answer for - Tenant landlords are over charged for Rent, Beer and spirits, the breweries see them as fair game. Any of the high earning tenanted pubs, the brewery will increase the rent to drive out the landlord and then put in their own manager

Windows Live User
While an anonymous treasury spokesman believes that tax on beer is important to contribution to the public finances the constant closing of pubs and loss of customers and less beer sold to the tune of 117Million pints would and should point out to him that he has strangled the golden goose. A 117million pints less is a drop in vat revenue of £58.5million and a drop in tax duty of a further £58.5million. Hope the treasury understand this and don't think that further increases will recover those lost monies Of course it goes deeper than that as pub closing means lost employment and lost paye plus lost revenue/tax on other products that can no longer be sold in a closed pub plus revenue/tax for suppliers to the now closed pub. The list goes on and on

stewgwyn
Valid point, WLU. Everybody's missed this one. You can't collect duty from beer in closed pubs !

Windows Live User
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stevie may
Soon a pint is going to be as expensive as Scandinavia, six quid a go. My friend in Finland travels to the Baltic states to bulk buy, much cheaper. The taxation on alcohol and tobacco in this country is immoral - just like the politicians who impose it

KneecapsNorman
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stewgwyn
Nail on the head, Stevie.

Adj Jackson
What few pick up on about toot n ploot in westminster is their bar where they get 3 parts cut before falling asleep at work is subsidised

john
Do the gobsmiths still enjoy taxpayer subsidised booze in their Houses Of Parliament drinking dens?

Michael Hawkins
They need something to lubricate and disinfect the throat after a long day of bull shoting

stewgwyn
I think that's why they wil not clobber the drunken hooligans, they have been known to enjoy the odd brawl in the Commons bar !

KneecapsNorman
well this will be an unpopular view, but i actually think that alcahol is the root cause of a lot of problems in this country, and i think they should tax it highly in order to help keep down over consumption.

Michael Hawkins
Norman I personally feel people are the root cause of all our problems a bit of selective culling would not go amis

Diane Rogers
Well said it would save the nhs money and stop trouble in the towns on Friday and Saturday nights

stewgwyn
Norman, you're right about the problem but I don't agree with the solution. Don't punish the majority of responsible social drinkers, hammer the drunken hooligans, we have the laws and the power, why doesn't it happen ?

stewgwyn
Diane, I think the type of people who cause the problems will always find money to pay for it, tax or no tax. I do however think, that sewage cannons, followed by jail would go a long way to solving the town centre problems on Friday & Saturday nights. Punishing the innocent is like keeping the whole class back after school because one person doesn't own up !

Diane Rogers
Stewgwymn good idea

Michael Hawkins
We have got used to the police turning a blind eye to the anti social behaviour that goes on a Friday and Saturday night. Where the courts do little or nothing to the offenders, the police officers are demotivated and feel its not worth the effort to arresting the culprits I will not go into town in the evening and I live near the largest south coast family holiday town I believe in Zero tolerance on all crimes however minor and sentence where the punishment fits the crime plus a hefty fine

Peter Coates
What about a tax on air. Thats about camerons level.

Nigel L
The money has to come from us plebs, who else is going to pay up! certainlynot the multi-national companies that own most of the UK they just shift money around to other countries ( all legal of cource )and end up paying peanuts, if anything at all, in taxes.

Daniel smith
I signed this petition, the people who enjoy a decent pint of beer have never are not the people who should suffer because of massive taxes. I saw 2lts of 8% cider in my local shop this morning,for £2.99!more than a pint of bitter these days. Maybe thats where the government should re-coup their losses?

stewgwyn
Yes Daniel, the stuff that's consumed in bus shelters, parks and subways, making them ''no go'' areas ! Leave us responsible drinkers alone !

Daniel smith
I signed this petition, the people who enjoy a decent pint of beer have never are not the people who should suffer because of massive taxes. I saw 2lts of 8% cider in my local shop this morning,for £2.99!more than a pint of bitter these days. Maybe thats where the government should re-coup their losses?

Jonathan Goodwin-Self
At the commons you can buy a pint of beer for 50 pence because they do not have tax or VAT on anything.

Michael Hawkins
But then they are most likely booking it to expenses so the tax payer is paying anyway

Adj Jackson
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SagePhotoWorld
I don't have a problem with alcohol and tobacco price escalators.
Name witheld
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Adj Jackson
Is that the same South Africa that has the murder capital of the world?? So ur point is
Name witheld
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Adj Jackson
Struck off by orange again for upsetting the free loading politicians and poking fun at the tramp JC lol

Mike Anon
I know my limits with alcohol, I just choose to ignore them!





Name witheld
3:46am on 28/10/2012
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Russell Clarke
9:27am on 28/10/2012
Only if you drink like some of the alcoholics do !!!!! You say your a cristian so you not realize that in the bible even Jesus drank wine !!!
Diane Rogers
10:06am on 28/10/2012
Russell not only alcoholics,what about drunk drivers who kill and maim innocent people
Russell Clarke
11:51am on 28/10/2012
@ Diane totally agree !!!!
Sham Roy
1:32pm on 28/10/2012
JC Turned water into wine but never & no way in the HB being mentioned that he ever drank it!
Daniel smith
3:04pm on 28/10/2012
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Adj Jackson
8:00am on 29/10/2012
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