Financial News
what do you think?
Ben Ralph
"..a one off transfer of assets from the Royal Mail pension fund.." that's the post workers pensions done over then, just like the doctors.
gengisken1227
Like a household spending more than it earns, this country will have to either (a) Earn more - not easy in a world deflation OR (b) Spend less, which means removing up to 20% from the public sector pay roll OR (c) Believe mathmatics doesn''t matter and gradually go bust
David Francis
I suspect that the government will chose 'C'! - that is if they've been educated by their own policies in the last 50 years
lol mcr
(d) Collect taxes from the avoiders
Michael Hawkins
D - is unlikely to work - as other countries have found to their costs the rich just move abroad The most sensible idea I have heard in years is get rid of all tax avoidance schemes including those approved by the government - charge a flat rate of tax for all - and make the onus on the tax payer to prove they are not earning the million rather than the tax man to prove they are -
happymike CHESTER
Yes only a true blue Tory would come up with a Tax like that, GREED is your downfall.
Mary Brown
Gengis... Trying to simplify the problem by comparing it to a single households budget, is just that, too simplistic, or should I say Government Policy. The reality is that a more subtle approach is required. A balance between cutting spending and promoting growth so that we can get people earning, off benefits and spending, to produce more growth. (apologies to those that only understand simple maths, and fail to understand slighly more complex Economics, like Chancellor Osbourne)
chris
I agree with him. 'Growth' is a funny thing, China funded its huge growth because the world market was booming so they needed thousands of new factories, cities and motorways etc. And with cheaper labour flood the world with export goods. Can't last! What can our government do? Borrow to build more schools and hospitals? done that. Borrow to build factories? Gordon saw no point in that. Employ more PS people? Looks good for a while! An 'earning and spending' economy...new cars next door!..but we still have to borrow record amounts each month, and on and on...
David Wragg
China's growth was also fuelled by a stubborn refusal to adjust its exchange rates to reflect the growth, which meant that Chinese exports were artificially cheap.
gengisken1227
Well yes I agree Mary, my serario is of course too simplistic, except the stark economic reality has not been provided for by politicians for people to even begin to consider the choices that, I beleive will ultimately be required to be made. While I believe you are completely correct with regard to growth, my contention is that for honest growth (i.e. not more debt fuelled growth) to begin, a complete reset is required with regard to the cost/taxation base of this country. China and the other BRICS are heading for a hard landing, QE has only masked our debt and liabilities problems. I am fearful for ours and our children's futures to the extent that for example, State pensions may no longer be affordable and healthcare rationed.
Michael Mcardle
mary the only way to get people off benefits is to create jobs we are all agreed on that. trouble is with your wonder boys ie the tories are doing nothing to achieve this. infact all signs are that the economic strategy they are persuing is hampering growth. 2 years into their savage cuts we are in a double dip recesion and unemployment is growing fast. now we might not all be as bright as you but we can see this government have and are failing the country badly
Michael Hawkins
You need to create real jobs not jobs paid for by government /tax payers, there is no point in taking money out of tax payer pockets and reduce their spending ability to take people of the dole and tax payers pay the twice as mutch to produde gods that no one can afford
red_lead
i am not the sharpest tool in the box but when are these loaded posh boys and girls going to wake up and smell the coffee? Higher taxes and more taxes with people getting less wages adds up to people spending less or not having money to spend and that means less tax income for the goverment to spend. that is why they are borrowing more. Realy it is not that hard to work out and fix. less taxes and less tax hikes and people would have more to spend and that would be more tax income! Also less sending money to other countrys and start using the money for the UK would add up to less borrowing to balance the books!!!
David Wragg
So, the cuts aren't working! The problem is that Osborne has stiffled the economy by a combination of tax increases, many of which are inflationary, and cuts, so income tax receipts fall and benefits payments rise. The so-called 'green energy policy' is iuneffectient and inflationary, and taxing fuel and the air passenger duty all make this a more expensive place in which to live or visit. The stupidity of it all is that we are vastly increasing overseas aid when we can't afford it and many of the recipients don't need it, such as India and Pakistan. Elsewhere, the people who need it aren't getting it, as in Zimbabwe, where the aid somehow gets lost and doesn't trickle down.
chris
I agree, the 'Green Energy policy' is very expensive, really for the very rich only! Our houshold Green policy is to burn less, insulate and work harder to keep warm. But government tax revenus fall with decreased economic activity, something that many EU governments now struggle with. But as long as inflation and interest rates stay as low as they are we will survive. A benefit not available to 'Euro' members. As to overseas aid, it is really quite small - about 0.5% of GDP per annum, a european norm. Amounts to about £10billion...Wales gets about £14billion, and Scotland gets about £40 to spend how it likes. Many would argue that aid is agood thing and certainly the general public give generously when asked.
David Wragg
Yes, the public do give generously, but that is their choice, not Cameron making it for them. In addition, the public aid is channelled through charities with people in the affected area who make sure it is spent wisely. The comparison with Scotland and Wales is wrong, as these are parts of the UK paying UK taxes, only the devolved governments have been given more power to make spending decisions.
chris
I mention Wales/Scotland only as a measure of scale.
Warren Brace
I'm with the PM on taking a hard line on scroungers. I'm 29, working class, self employed and on a low income. My fiancee is a primary school teacher. We have a mortgage to pay and are planning a family after the wedding but only when we can afford it. We're both from working class families, neither of our sets of parents own their own homes and we've never claimed any sort of benefits. We wouldn't even consider making our lives someone else's responsibility. It's all about prioritising spending, my fiancee is regularly sickened when children arrive at school without having had breakfast, in dirty uniform and shoes which don't fit. When asked the parent normally spits "can't afford it" between sucking in lungfulls of smoke from one of their forty cigarettes that day.
David Wragg
Well said, and best wishes for the wedding.
Warren Brace
Thank you David.
Michael Mcardle
warren stop talking a load of rubbish, bot everyone on benefits sits in the pub all day smoking cigarettes. youre another one who has obviousley read the tory propaganda on benefit claimants. shame on you. if that was the case why isnt your fiancee doing her job and involving social workers.as for you being on a low income what about your partners income.does that not count .just thank your lucky stars and stop complaining
lol mcr
So if the cost of living keeps increasing, taxes keep rising, your mortgage interest rate goes up. What will you do then? Just accept that this is the way things are? Tighten your belt further? Never start a family? Stop making out that you're a saint. Why is it that as soon as spending goes up there is a knee jerk reaction and benefits are the first thing everyone jumps on. Inefficiency? Quangos? Corruption? Too hard to tackle them so we'll just pick on the most vulnerable and uneducated in society. What a load of cowards.
Michael Mcardle
spot on lol nice to know there are people out there who knows the true situation. blaming everthing on benefit claimants isnt only cowardly but ut also shows they are in denial . compared to the money this government is wasting.on all of the things you mention. then of course their wages and perks benifit payments are a drop in the ocean. its time they opened their eyes to the real problems. baaa baaa
chris
It's not a load of rubbish. Surely you dont support those who plan to use the benefit system lifelong? I will always remember a one time 'colleague' in the(Home Office Directorate of Telecomms) civil service who announced that he planned on a medical retirement in his early fifties. I learned since that he has acheived his goal, by transferring to the Police after the 'Directorate' closed. You have to stay with a benign employer to do this. Young Peter was a keen trade union man. You learn to play the game to maximum advantage and keep a big stick to hit your employer.
Andrew Brown
Well said Warren. Michael as ever is not in touch with the reality the country finds itself in. Of course every politician would love to shower the electorate with benefits and freebies - no better way to buy votes. However benefits should be a safety net - that was the original intention. Since then they have ballooned out of all proportion and can now be considered a lifestyle choice. If everyone in the country had your attitude Michael, we would be in the mother of all messes, in fact we would be third world.
Alf Bibby
Re picture They could be a pop group I would call it "The Four Clowns of number 11" Dozy Beaky Mick and Titch
David Wragg
Alf, 'pop' means popular, and I don't think this bunch is at all popular. Not even with me, and I am a Tory.
Ann Bond
please dont be unfair dozy beaky mitch and tich could be a pop group these idiots couldn't organise a p-ss up in a brewery even if they were told and shown how to do it
Michael Hawkins
did not Tony Blair live at no 11 as the flat was bigger to enable him to fit his ego in so I can only assume you are talking about Blair brown darling and Balls
Michael Mcardle
i see them more like thefour horses of the apocalypse
Michael Hawkins
Give up the drugs ,you might find it helps
roy winbow
If I ran my own business I would have to pay my bills before I could pay myself, how come the government seem to do it the other way round so that the taxpayer gets the dirty end of the stick
Michael Mcardle
dont you worry about them roy they will never let themselves run short.they will always be at the front with their hands out regardless of how much economic mess the country finds itself in. looking out for number one thats their priority
chris
That's a bit like saying 'if I played the violin I would be very good at it' ! The government isn't a business - it makes no profit at anything. It spends a budget, thats all. Many thousands of working businesses make a profit here and generate tax revenue for the country, in an environment that the government Do influence/control.
Michael Hawkins
Chris I work for an organisation funded by the government - we are given an annual budget that we are expected to spend to the penny and have achieved for the last four year within .0009% last year If the government was to be held to the same level of financial accountability that we are - say maximum spend of 35% of GDP as it was before the last stint of labour mis-management of the economy It is easy for Politicians to keep spending to keep the electorate happy - unfortunately someone at a later date will pick up the bill
Ann Bond
well well I Thought they were supposed to reduce borrowing not increasing it. Stop giving it to countries that dont need it, Use the bonuses to help ofset the dept the goverment says we owe. BUT IT DOES SHOW WHAT A BUNCH OF LIARS THE GOVERMENT IS DON'T IT
Michael Hawkins
Higher unemployment - lower taxes means more spending unless you reduce individuals benefits to the budget available
Andrew Brown
Just shows how debt breeds more debt - debt corrodes a country to the core. It took 13 years to get into this mess, starting from a budget surplus. Dont be surprised if it takes 13 years plus to turn the country around, however I think it will be too much for the electorate to bear, so beprepared for more damage if debt reduction policy changes due to an election or from people pressure.
Andrew Brown
Well said Warren. Michael as ever is not in touch with the reality the country finds itself in. Of course every politician would love to shower the electorate with benefits and freebies - no better way to buy votes. However benefits should be a safety net - that was the original intention. Since then they have ballooned out of all proportion and can now be considered a lifestyle choice. If everyone in the country had your attitude Michael, we would be in the mother of all messes, in fact we would be third world.
Peter Edwardson
It's pretty obvious really the so called cuts are only scratches and not nearly enough to put the country back to being financially sound. I still see us spending on many things that are not necessary for example: Over inflated senior level Public sector salaries and number of personnel, Breeding, Legal costs, Overseas aid, immigration etc. If the problem is to be solved it will need some proper cuts not borrowing more money.
Billy Morrison
9:08am on 26/6/2012
wot do u expect wen u put v.a.t.up to 20% duty on wot the workers enjoy most a pint a fag + petrol for the car we can only afford wot we earn + cant claim expenses like the m.ps
Warren Brace
12:07pm on 26/6/2012
Prioritise your spending, beer and cigarettes are expensive, so don't buy them. We need three things to survive, air, sustenance and shelter, one of those is free (for me anyway, there are many who don't have to pay for the houses they shelter in). I think the PM is right to take a hard line on those who think they should be supported by the state, I'm 29, working class, self employed on a low income and am paying a mortgage, I've never claimed any state benefits and my fiancee and I are going to wait until we can afford it before we have children. We wouldn't even consider making our lives someone else's responsibility. Going back to my first point of priorities, my fiancee who is a primary school teacher regularly sees children sent to school without breakfast, in dirty clothes and shoes which don't fit, when looked into the answer given is normally "can't afford it" while the parent sucks on their one of forty cigarettes of the day.
stephen
2:15pm on 26/6/2012
warren i know people on the dole they don't smoke don't drink . so please stop reading the the sun
Keith Harrison
6:16pm on 26/6/2012
Stephen. I know people on the dole too. MOST do drink and smoke. I know one in particular who has a free house, free council tax, dole, child tax credits for 2 kids, 2x child allowance, and CSA off 2 unfortunate fathers. And she still cant buy school uniform, but CAN smoke. There are some people who need the help of the state benefit system, but there are a lot more who need a kick up the rear to discover what the words 'work', 'pride', 'responsibility', and even 'parasite' mean!
Name witheld
1:45pm on 27/6/2012
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Michael Hawkins
2:10pm on 27/6/2012
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Michael Hawkins
2:19pm on 27/6/2012
Keith Totally agree There are those who chose to struggle and allow their children to live under the poverty line A young lad who worked for me part time, in line with his allowance on benefits a few years ago. He frequently was unable to feed his children He and his partner were able to smoke 40 a day, run a large 3.5 ltr car, keep 2 large dogs, a large koi pond, and always had the latest phones on contract It was their choice of to spend on luxeries whilst neglecting their children
lol mcr
7:03pm on 27/6/2012
I'm confused by the responses to Billy's post. Where does he mention benefits or children? Warren, are you saying that so long as we have shelter and food we should be grateful? What about the people who earn minimum wage who can['t afford to save up for a mortgage, a wedding, a holiday etc are you saying they shouldn't even be able to have a cigarette or a pint? What if the cost of living increases further, should they be content with bread and water?
lol mcr
7:08pm on 27/6/2012
BTW, I was brought up in a family on benefits and I always had 3 good meals a day and clean clothes, unlike some of my friends with working parents who had to fend for themselves. People are individuals - working parents are not all good and parents on benefits are not all bad
Michael Mcardle
3:36pm on 28/6/2012
oh give it a rest warren repeating the old mantra over and over aint gonna get you any more sympathy. you run your own buisness your fiancee is a teacher yet you still insist youre on a low income how low exactly. you dont have any idea what its like to live in poverty.get off your highy horse and be thankful for what you have, youre one of the lucky ones